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Thread: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

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    Greater crested hermit ninja Boylee's Avatar
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    [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    cp_cruff_a7



    cp_cruff is a 3 stage sequential CP map in the dustbowl vein. It takes inspiration from dustbowl (durr), goldrush and gorge (amongst others). I'm trying to build a map that plays like a blend of all three of these, with a bit of high-tech Red mountain base thrown into the mix for good measure.

    I think I've managed to fix up most of the glaring issues with this release and most importantly the last stage should no longer feel like dustbowl. I've also converted all of the entity work back so that red are defending and blue are attacking (just like vanilla gameplay). This will most likely be on eof the final layout tweaking releases as I'm starting to feel quite happy with how it plays, with that in mind any testing that's possible would be really useful as I need to know of any glaring issues before moving onto detailing.

    I think that I'll release this version on tf2maps.net as well, as it's at a stage now where it should be slightly harder to rip into so easily.

    here's some screenies for your viewing pleasure:
    Spoiler: Reveal





















    Oh and yeah before I forget: DOWNLOAD LINK
    Code:
    Changelog:
    
    A1 released
    
    A2 released
    + Removed cave between CP1A and CP1B
    + Added a flanking route to CP1B
    + significantly increased light in the cave at CP2A
    + Added (the start of a) feature waterfall at CP2A and put a hole in the cave roof
    + Changed flanking route from RED spawn at CP3A
    + Made the route from CP3A to CP3B tighter
    + Added goalstrings to explain objectives better
    + Tweaked lighting all over
    + Fixed some incorrectly lit props
    + Fixed some doors not working properly
    + Added some more props and detailing like stairs
    
    A3 released
    + scaled journey between last two points down
    + fixed door from blu spawn to cp3A not locking after red cap cp3A
    + clipped one of the roofs at cp1B and added an archway on the opposite side
    + added some health and ammo in the upper route to cp2B
    + added a ledge at cp2B for FaN scouts, solis and demos
    + added some props at cp2B to allow players to climb onto the gangways
    + added props to final bridge for cover and tweaked final point geometry
    
    a4 released
    + added displacements to the first stage
    + lengthened the run up to the first point to make it a touch easier to defend
    + fixed areaportals in RED spawn
    + properly clipped of areas between stages 
    
    a5 released
    + switched teams back to red defending and blue attacking
    + redesigned buildings at cp_2b
    + tweaked layout of cp_3a
    + almost entirely redesigned layout of routes from cp_3a to cp_3b
    + revised health and ammo layout throughout
    + large skybox brushes added to optimise areas by cutting them of from one another
    
    a5a released
    + fixed broken shorcut door from red spawn to cp_3a
    + fixed visible nodraw brushes in the underground route to cp_3b
    
    a6 released
    + added another spawn exit and route to the point at to red's first spawn
    + lowered and angled roof at cp_2a
    + added another route for attackers to take left high ground at cp_2a
    + raised and clipped off upper roof at cp_2b
    + raised floor and removed roof of building in front of cp_3a
    + added some covered areas for spies and snipers at cp_3b
    + lowered the raised walkway at cp_3b so all classes can use it
    + playerclipped some roofs around cp_1b that should've been clipped before
    + removed a walkway, moved a door and moved some cover at cp_2b to make it more defendable
    + ADDED DISPLACEMENTS TO THE CAVE!
    
    a6a released
    + fixed several lighting errors
    + lowered the floor of the building opposite cp_3a
    + sorted out the shortcut door in red's final spawn
    + replaced raised walkway at cp_3b with a much lower one
    + fixed a few clipping issues, floating props and general mistakes
    
    a7 released
    + redesigned area behind cp_2a to make it more defensible
    + added a sniper deck at the back of cp_2a
    + adjusted heights and cover at cp_3a to make it more defensible
    + rearranged health and ammo around cp_2a and cp_3a
    + added displacements to cp_2b, cp_3a and cp_3b
    + adjusted ammo at cp_2b
    + added patch overlays under health and ammo kits
    + func_nobuild areas immediately outside the spawn doors at cp_3b
    + playerclipped any existing steps
    + added some more signs
    Code:
    Known issues:
    - respawn wave times may need adjusting as well as possibly tweaking cap times
    Last edited by Boylee; 27-04-2011 at 02:20. Reason: a7 \o/
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    cp_triplet - ctf_chicane - cp_cruff - pl_clifftop

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  2. #2
    Windows Only MacNetron's Avatar
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    Re: cp_cruff_a1

    Hoi hoi hoi!
    Ready to try it! Looking quite good already

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    Re: cp_cruff_a1

    OOOOO love it, love the look, love the style. nice one.
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    (1)Spudd has joined the game. Spudd's Avatar
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    Re: cp_cruff_a1

    whoa Boylee this looks wicked bud
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    ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) Logan's Avatar
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    Re: cp_cruff_a1

    Superb stuff mate I'll get it on the teamplay now Can't wait to play
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    Errk, I had a nice long "Ooh, wow" post prepared, but lost it -.-

    The summary was: Really well balanced points that really rewarded team play.

    Missing things, but can't remember what This post will grow as I do remember them.... xD
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    ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) Logan's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    Played superbly well for an a1. Notable highlights - defending the first point (then taking it quickly next round ) and the last cp on stage 2/1st on stage 3. It's stunning - or will be when the skybox etc is in

    I've linked you up to the demo i took Honestly hard to fault at the minute. All I can say is I enjoyed every minute of playing and didn't have time to think about feedback - nothing irritated me....Great job!
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    Thats what she said ... Sn0w's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    yeah very goood map loved it played great, I remember there was a slight sticky door someoen mentioned in the middle on stage 1 between point 1 and 2 somewhere. Got very slightly lost on stage 3 but thats nothing. Very good job, hats off
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    🍕Mr🍕Man🍕The🍕Pizza🍕Fan🍕 Post Script's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    Awesome awesome job for an a1!

    Only improvement I can think of is the first stage sliding door section between cap 1 and cap 2, would be nice to have some continuity between the points instead of those metal shutters.
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    Greater crested hermit ninja Boylee's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    Wow! Overwhelmingly positive guys, thank you very much. Can't wait to watch the demo Colt.
    I'll take a look at those doors Sn0w, thanks for that.
    Post I had those doors in to close of sniper lines earlier on in dev, but now you mention it there's not really any need for them. Thanks I'll take it under advisement [/gruber] for the second alpha.

    Hopefully some more thorough testing will reveal any errors in balancing that are present. Keep it coming guys, any criticisms welcome
    cp_triplet - ctf_chicane - cp_cruff - pl_clifftop

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    Playstuff Member .ps SPHinx's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff_a1

    I will describe what I saw with the large sliding door between pts 1 and 2 in stage 1. After we defended and switched teams, the door model appeared to me to have rotated 90 degrees, exposing the "hall of mirrors" effect of a closed portal. Odd.

    I had a lot of fun on this map, and I am sad to say that I only really feel like I experienced the first stage. I got somehow lost from the action in stages 2 and 3. But stage 1 is a lot of fun. The 2nd point there is very defensible, but not so much so that a quick attacking team cannot still grab it (as you will see from the demo). The 1st point is hard to judge. As with most of these kinds of CP maps, until the defenders know what they are doing, getting there and setting up a strong defense is tough.

    But I like the look and I like that BLU is on defense (although you should change the goal string message since it still tells BLU to defend their points against BLU).
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    As with the others, I really like the map, very nice work.

    Played it last night, and just having a run through now, only really noticed minor bugs, and the odd thing that might need tweaking for balance.

    One thing I found on every point (I think), you only cap when you're stood on the actual point (circular prop), when it looks like the area around it should cap as well.

    I'm not sure that I like spawning facing the wrong direction on stage 1 red, it seems strange. In setup it's fine, but when you're spawning to attack point 2, I feel it should be simpler to get out without running a little circle. Might just be me though.
    If the windows at the top looking directly at red spawn are meant to be sniper area, they could do with being a little bit bigger, as it is, you haven't got that great of a view as you can only see the top half of the spawn and none of the area below. It also looks like you'd be harder to hit the way the bars on the windows are.
    Other than that the first point looks like it should play great, and easy enough for a stage 1, point 1.
    I'm not sure the bit with the rock in the middle just after the first point is really necessary, it breaks the flow of the map a bit and I can't see anyone staying in that area for long. That area does seem like a bit of a choke as well.
    The point itself looks quite easy to defend, all the entrances are small and in the same area. It's also enclosed, which helps the defenders quite a bit.
    It looks like it will be quite hard for defenders spawning and trying to stop a cap, they've got a long way to run and the shortest route is through a small doorway. It might be an idea to open up the point a bit more, not sure exactly how though.
    Also, some ammo near the point might be nice, maybe by the little computer console bit.


    The second stage looks great, shame we didn't get to play it much last night.
    There's a random floating prop:

    You can get stuck in these rocks (pretty much in the spot where the crosshair is):

    Can't say I can see anything else that could be a problem with this stage, maybe that the second stage might be too hard to defend, not sure.

    The first point on stage 3 looks good, but there's only one small health kit, not sure it's much of a problem (throughout the map I keep comparing it to dustbowl in my mind to try and think whether it would work, and this is the same as dustbowl 3:1, which is okay).
    There's some more windows which are too small to shoot out of (you have to aim upwards to fire out):

    Other than that, stage 3 looks great.


    Really looking forward to playing this some more.



    Also, I was looking around the map and saw this:

    Hidden room/easter egg? Or just something you forgot to take out?
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    I really liked it but i felt there were too many roller shutter doors...
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    not sure about the cave but otherwise, looking good so far
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    Greater crested hermit ninja Boylee's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    Ok, thanks fellas, lot's there to be going on with, but it's all good stuff.

    After watching the demo (thanks Colt) I think the main problems centre around CP_1B and the route from CP_1A.
    I think you guys are totally right about that roller door section, it has to go. I have no idea why the door would've rotated 90 degrees like SPHinx said but deleting them should sort it out. I'll use the space that was the little cave to introduce a route into the high ground for the attackers too I think.
    Also I agree that the big crane building on the point is looking like it's too easy to defend for a second CP of a 3 stage map. I'm going to open it up and introduce another route into it methinks. I'm also toying with the idea of removing the ramp by the defenders spawn that lets them get up to the walkway easily.

    @Calump, I'm afraid it's not an easter egg it's just a small area that I used to set up my gameplay entities and test them before putting them into the map.
    @Jim which cave bit? The portion on the first stage or the huge cave the second CP is in?

    Issues I will address next:
    • rework routes from CP_1A to CP_1B
    • make CP_1B harder to defend by opening up the point, offering another attacking route and maybe shutting down the defenders routes a little.
    • buildings have odd sized windows (CP_1A & CP_3A)
    • goal string message
    • floating prop at CP_2B (this was actually the first mistake I noticed after compile *facepalm*)


    Other things that I think will need addressing but need more playtesting first:
    • CP_2B is too easy to attack. I think I need to close down offensive routes a bit and maybe create a more protected spawn.
    • Lower route into CP_3A maybe too well covered and may penetrate too far into blu territory.
    • Route from CP_3A to CP_3B seems quite short and wide in retrospect, may need to be lengthened and and made narrower.


    Thanks for all the feedback chaps, it's invaluable

    P.S. I know that the reason a lot of my props appear unlit is because they have their lighting origin buried in brushwork, but I'm unaware of how to fix this. Can anyone shed any light on the situation?
    cp_triplet - ctf_chicane - cp_cruff - pl_clifftop

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    Administrator jim's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee



    and the other one like that, going to be hard getting that to play well and look good, you should do something like have it open at the top or something, at least some way of letting sun in (plus would have the added benefit of being able to add landmark silhouettes letting the player orientate himself easily which doesn't look like it has with light like that)

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    Windows Only MacNetron's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    I like the cave! Nice to have an outdoor-indoor-outdoor map.
    AFAIK Jim's remarks are for player orientation? In that case you might try a hole in the roof and/or a waterfall on one side.

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    Greater crested hermit ninja Boylee's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    There are plans for the cave, remember this is only the first alpha
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    Administrator jim's Avatar
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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    Quote Originally Posted by MacNetron View Post
    I like the cave! Nice to have an outdoor-indoor-outdoor map.
    AFAIK Jim's remarks are for player orientation? In that case you might try a hole in the roof and/or a waterfall on one side.
    exactly, just think people are going to get easily confused if it stays at the same general light level

    Quote Originally Posted by Boylee View Post
    There are plans for the cave, remember this is only the first alpha
    that's not a good thing to be saying by your argument all criticism is invalid because it's in first alpha and will or at least should be changing here and there, any criticism is good criticism

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    Re: [WIP] cp_cruff - Developer: Boylee

    i kep reading this as cp_ crufts

    Woof !
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